- 1.One event from Ursula Mahlendorf's memoir that i find insightful
was when She stood looking with envy at an older German boy getting in
a glider, yet thinking "exceptional boys and women had a chance for
anything boys and men did." It is peculiar to see such equality In
a totalitarian government such as Nazi Germany.
2.One event from Josie Martin's memoir that i find insightful is when
Josie's parents send her to a convert school and tell her that her new
name is now Josie L'Or. It is interesting how both gentile and Jewish children
were separated from their parents in one way or another.
1. How did you feel When you first found out about the murder of millions
of Jews during the Holocaust.(Mahlendorf)
2. Is a convert school a place where children of the Jewish religion convert
to Christianity?(Martin)
- Events:
1. From reading chapter 4 of Ursula Mahlendorf's book, one thing that struck
me the most was when she described the pervasiveness of Nazi ideals. Nazi
ideology was ubiquitous enough to show up in a math problem given to the
students in class.
2. From Josie Martin I found it ironic that a child who knew nothing of
the situation she was placed in at the time was being forced to learn and
practice a religion different from the one that forced her family to leave
its home.
Questions:
1. For Ursula, having the experience you did in the Hitler youth, what
responsibility do you feel that generations born to parents involved in
the Nazi party have today?
2. For Josie, looking back today, how do you feel about having to take
on a new name, religion and essentially a new existence during the war?
- 1.
A. From Josie Martin's excerpts, the parts regarding French collaborators
and resistance was particularly interesting. I did not know that there
were French who collaborated with the Nazis to the extent as to turn in
Jewish residents living in the various towns. I was aware that there was
official support from France in the form of the Vichy government, however
was unaware of the extent to which common people supported the Nazi cause.
Additionally, I thought the French Resistance led by the Maquis represented
a troubling paradox of the time. Martin writes that "That's the Resistance.
Those Maquis do what they have to do, then they go back underground and
innocent people are left for the reprisals" (pg 138). This paradox
between resistance against the Nazi's and alienation among the French people
seems to represent the problem with with resistance against an occupying
army that punishes the general population for a resistance movement's actions.
This punishment of common people due to association with Resistance fighters
is clear in a passage in which "Two soldiers seized them as others
began to beat the Old man, but meanwhile a whole truckload of soldiers
entered the little cottage and discovered an old English Tommy gun."Cook
gasped, "Afais non, every Frenchman who fought in the Great war has
some kind of arms ... not as weapons, as souvenirs"."And so,
they beat the old man to death with the child watching, then set ftre to
the cottage, and as they got back in their trucks, the commander ordered
them to leave, but there was a last shot. .. and the little boy was no
more." pg 140
This execution of the old man and little boy seems aimed at decreasing
support for Resistance fighters through brutalizing their main form of
support: the common people of towns and villages. Through brutalizing supporters,
the Nazis made it a risky an unprofitable business to support resistance
movements.
B. Prof. Mahlendorf'
"None of us understood that we had just absorbed the key concepts
that were to guide our lives as HJ members—that we were a special,
valuable class, representing a new age for Germany; that we would serve
Germany and Hitler, whatever the danger or hardship; that we were ready
to sacrifice our lives so that Germany could live free of her enemies."
For me this statement seems reflective of much more than a personal sacrifice
of one girl for Germany. It brings to mind the ritualization and aggrandizing
of the Nazi party. And it is the purpose of this aggrandizing, to work
towards the Furhrer, of preemptive obedience that is most troubling. Institutions
such as the Hitler Youth seem to have been aimed at creating a generation
of children who's sole motivating drive was to please Hitler, and in doing
so, preserve Germany, regardless of person cost.
What this undying loyalty created then, was (at the time) an inclusion
in "the group" that removed any guilt or responsibility to question
what was going on. The Hitler Youth theme song that the little girls are
forced to learn served to reinforce the notion that the country, and Hitler,
was more important than the individual. This not only implies the the country
is more important than German, but also that anyone not considered German
was an enemy and must be trying to harm Hitler or Germany. It must have
been quite persuasive and intimidating to be confronted with such ritualization
and indoctrination. Whether or not this ritualization and intimidation
means youth were exempt from the repercussions of their decisions is a
question that I hope one of our two guests can answer. Was there any understanding
of their guilt, or did that come after the war had ended, and the "man
behind the curtain" was revealed to be the monster that he was.
2. Questions
A. Prof. Mahlendorf- Were you aware at some point that you were being
indoctrinated into an organization that supported "working towards
the Furhrer" and his horrible policies, or did that realization come
after the war ended and Hitler's attrocities were revealed?
B. Josie-
Did you have any understanding of yourself as a Jew at the time? Did you
notice any different status afforded you? Was your situation common in
France at the time?
- 1. Josie: I thought it was interesting in Josie’s story when
she compared herself to her friend, Jacqueline. She compared the amount
of toys that Jacqueline had to the amount of toys she had. When Josie and
her family fled their home, they didn’t have room for toys in their
car. Jacqueline had dolls, blocks and games and Josie only had tin cans
that her mother had made for her so that they could make mud pies. This
was not really a big deal, but it just showed the differences between Josie,
who was a Jew, and her friend, who was not.
After you were evacuated and before you lived in the convent, what was
your life like? Did you go to school?
2. Prof. Mahlendorf: I thought it was interesting to see someone that had
grown up in the Hitler Youth and had been around that ever since they could
remember. To Ursula, the Hitler Youth was the only thing she knew and no
one was telling her differently. She looked up to her youth leader and
her thoughts were molded to what the Hitler Youth wanted her thoughts to
be. I thought it was interesting that her mother did not express her disapproval
to Ursula and her brother more. At one point, Ursula states that, “We
agreed that it would have been enormously helpful to us if even one of
the adults around us had attempted to counteract this indoctrination, had
told us that other values existed aside from bravery, toughness, obedience,
and loyalty unto death—that other nations, races, and peoples valued
their way of life and were worthy of respect”. I just think it is
interesting to think about the person that most people have targeted as
a horrible person, when in reality she is just a little girl that only
knew the beliefs of the Hitler Youth.
How much was actually said and known about the war and the treatment of
the Jews to the German people?
- 1.
-Mahlendorf
It is interesting how Nazi Germany conducted everything under its control
with the highest level of military precision. There is uncanny resemblance
to how the HJ and the concentration camps were operated. The whole Nazi
regime was run through fear, whether it was towards its privileged Aryan
citizens or its Jewish prisoners.
-Martin
I have never learned about the evacuation of people from Alsace Lorraine
or any other territory contested by the Germans. It is common to hear about
refugees sneaking away and being smuggled out of dangerous territories,
but I have never heard of these exoduses of entire populations.
2.
-Mahlendorf
How have your experiences as a Hitler Youth affected your relationship
with your children, if you have any?
-Martin
What sources did you use in writing this memoir? Is it entirely from memory…partly
made up? Did other people help refresh your memory? (Is it written for
children?)
- 1. One part of Mahlendorf’s memoir I found interesting was when
she was visiting her Uncle Richard and Aunt Helen. When she tells her uncle
that she was chosen for leadership training in the Hitler Youth he turns
away and she says that she noticed a decline in their relationship after
that. Also when she is visiting, her uncle tells a joke against Hitler
and the party. Her aunt is horrified that her uncle would tell a joke to
Ursula and after that, they didn’t make anymore political jokes.
Further, when they had people over her Aunt would have her to eat in the
kitchen and anytime Ursula walked by the table the adults would stop talking
immediately. I thought this was interesting because it shows how indoctrinated
Ursula was and the amount of fear that the adults, who it appeared weren’t
enthusiastic about Hitler, had towards her because she was in Hitler Youth.
I thought that part where Josie is concerned for her parent well being
because they didn’t have a cross at home to protect them was interesting
because Josie was so young when she was put in the convent and didn’t
seem to have an understanding of what it mean to be Jewish or Christian.
She understood there was a difference but not what that difference was.
Josie also made a cross from cardboard to send to her parents and she asks
Jesus to watch over her parents even though they are not Christian and
promises to tell them all about him when the war is over. I thought this
was interesting because Josie because she was so young quickly learns about
Christianity and believes so sincerely that the cross and Jesus will protect
whoever believes in him and truly believes that because her parents don’t
have the cross in their house they are unprotected.
2. After the war how long did it take to unlearn everything that was
taught to you in the Hitler Youth? When did you fully realize or understand
the effects of the HJ on your life? How did you feel in the years directly
following the fall of the Third Reich about your involvement in the Hitler
Youth?
In your memoirs you talked about how you wanted to make a cross for
you parents to protect them, after the war did you retain any of the Christian
practices you learned in the convent?
- Martin:
Question: What made you decide to pen your novel in the tense and format
that you did? Was it done to help portray the story in a certain light?
A citation from Martin’s work, “At least this part is like
Papa said, she has the beautiful name,” struck me as it supremely
reflects the nativity of Josie. She is miserable and lonely in the nunnery,
yet she treasures her new alias of grandeur L’Or viewing it as a
luxury of sorts, rather than realizing it is a means to conceal her Jewish
heritage. There is a paradox of sorts as she is living in this realm of
calamity amidst a world verging on chaos. She is so fond of her alias,
due to its translation to gold. This quote struck me as particularly insightful
as it reveals what is going on within Josie’s mindset as the rest
of the chapter is told mainly from the perspective of adults around her.
Mahlendorf:
Question: Your personal story is not a point-of-view that is usually spoken
about in such detail, as someone who rallied behind the Fuhrer with such
enthusiasm as a youth leader. What inspired or motivated you to share your
story with the world in this publication?
I found the act of Mahlendorf deciding to publish her story in itself
inspiring. Her story is not one that is not looked highly upon as one who
possessed enthusiasm for Hitler as a prominent member of one of the Fuhrer’s
youth leadership groups. I recently saw the film Boy in the Striped Pajamas
in which over the course of the film viewers watch a young girl fall under
the influence of such youth leadership groups, which helped me to visualize
Mahlendorf as she takes you on her journey as she became bewitched my the
appeal of Nazi ideology.
- Events
For Martin’s article: The passage that described her father and
her sitting in the woods talking was extremely interesting to me. It is
saddening to see the loss of religion that she had to go through in order
to survive the war. It is striking also, because both her father and herself
feel the same amount of grief at one another’s inabilities to understand.
Her father knows that she is now a Christian, and is given a Christian
education, and she is upset that he seemingly does not know how to take
care of the flowers she so desperately wants to get to her mother.
For Mahlendorf: It is interesting to see the in dept account of Nazi
youth education regarding sexuality. The idea of serving the Fuhrer perpetuated
every part of German culture, in ways that is not often portrayed in Nazi
history. The need to carry out their German duty by providing Hitler with
kids is a disturbing yet patriotic way in which German women can carry
out their duty.
Questions
Josie Martin: How difficult was it to censor your grown opinions and
thoughts and embrace the voice of the little girl? Were there times when
you felt as if she had taken over and it was not really you writing at
all?
Mahlendorf: What are your thoughts about the Obama campaign and the
way that it touched the youth of America? Any major similarities to Nazi
youth?
- 1. Ursula Mahlendorf cut up her mother’s fur coat in order to
donate the fur to the soldiers on the Eastern Front. She states that she
thought that ‘I had done the right thing for the Fuhrer.’ This
anecdote shows how affective the indoctrination of her had been. Her loyalty
lay not with her mother but with Hitler.
Question: did the closeness in age of the squad leaders to the members
in the Jungmadel organization cause any problems?
2. Even when she was just a young child Josie Martin knew that it was
wrong for the mademoiselle to be fraternizing with German Soldiers. She
did not know why, but she knew that they were the enemy. It shows that,
to her, people in the war were divided very clearly between the ‘good’
and the ‘bad’, but that, in reality, the situation was a far
more complicated.
Question: why is the memoir written in the third person?
- Ursula Mahlendorf:
A story that I found particularly interesting was in late 1941. Marga,
Ursula’s squad leader told the squad that they needed to collect
warm clothes for the soldiers on the eastern front. Ursula took the fur
off the collar of her’s and her mom’s jackets with scissors.
When her mom discovered this she was angry at Ursula, but Ursula still
ran off with the fur to her HJ meeting to contribute them to her squad.
-Was there an age difference associated with the acceptance of the Hitler
Youth, as with Ursula and her mother?
Josie Martin:
An anecdote that I found interesting was when Josie accompanied Mademoiselle
Gilberte out into the woods. She told Josie to take a nap, while she then
secretly “collaborated” with a German soldier, one time Josie
watched and she came to the conclusion that it was dangerous to be near
a German soldier and she felt in danger even watching.
-How did Josie cope all those years living with a secret, and how did
she as a small child not reveal her true identity to the wrong people?
- Events
* The young men slowly filtering out of the town Mahlendorf was living
in while she was a Hitler Youth. Also, women taking the roles men once
had. Showed the impact of the war directly on special groups like the Hitler
Youth and towns all around Germany. No one was safe from the war. It's
very disturbing to see that Hitler's beloved people were being sent off
to war to die for a silly cause.
* When the girl asks her mother what religion they are after her mother
refuses to go into a Christian church and says that they are not Christian
and do not follow Jesus. Also, when the girl asks her mother what religion
they are, the mother does not tell her. This is insightful because it shows
that the mother does not want her child to know that her religion is not
well liked and that since she is sent away to a convent, the mother is
trying to protect her daughter by not telling her their religion. This
way the daughter does not get confused when she is sent away. It's showing
that the mother knew what was to come and didn't want her daughter to be
confused about what was happening to her and her beliefs.
Questions
* Mahlendorf -- Did you know how your parents felt about the group
of Hitler Youth? Were they happy that you were part of something like that?
* Martin -- The story is told through the eyes of a child. Do you think
that it enabled you to tell more things within your book than if you were
telling it from another point of view?
- Josie Martin
A part from Martin’s selection that struck home with me was her
description of her first interaction with the nun at the convent. The degrading
and subservient language Martin uses, I think, really sets the tone of
the relationship she has when the nun (“lower your eyes”).
It also throws into relief how the events during this time period affected
peoples’ lives. For Martin, being separated from her family at such
a young age, being put into an unfriendly environment, etc. is just a single
microcosm of the entire Third Reich era. For many people, not knowing what
was happening to their friends and family was one of the more unnerving
aspects of Jewish persecution. For some reason, this scene makes the stark
reality of familial separation that much more brutal.
Question: What were the events leading up to your parents sending you
to the convent?
Ursula Mahlendorf
The most poignant moment, for me, in Mahlendorf’s excerpt is her
description of Wanda. Although it is relatively small, and seemingly insignificant,
she became friends with Wanda, a polish fieldworker. She knew that she
should not be friends with her, as she was “a proud German girl.”
This moment shows that race and preconceived notions regarding it do not
matter once a personal relationship or friendship has been established.
The message is simple: the common bond of humanity should rise above hatred
stemming from petty cultural, racial, ideological differences. It is also
interesting to note that she knew she should not be friends with her, but
chose to do so anyway.
Question: Why did you choose to become friends with Wanda, even though
you knew you should not?
- Events
from Prof. Mahlendorf’s memoir: It was not a particular moment
in Prof. Mahlendorf’s memoir that struck me, but a general progression
that she talked about—the idea of belonging in the Hitler Youth.
In the beginning, joining the HJ presented the young girl with the comfort
of being something larger than herself. However, once she went to the HJ
leadership training, Mahlendorf became ever more isolated. It just shows
the utter hypocrisy of the Nazi ideology and lifestyle. It is very twisted
that something that seems so inclusive becomes so alienating once you get
up in the ranks, and this obviously served the Nazi regime. Pointing out
these seemingly subtle and imperceptible ways that the German public was
duped into either participating or ignoring the destruction of the Nazi
party is really important. Showing the confusion and the way that people
can be convinced of two contradictory things at the same time is important
to an outsider’s understanding of how Hitler controlled a country.
from Josie Levy Martin’s Never Tell Your Name: The scene where
Josie’s mother and father tell her the new name that she must use
is very heart wrenching and beautiful. We see the event through the eyes
of a young child, but the reader gets a much greater understanding of what
is happening to the child. It shows the importance of a name and the connection
that it has with your identity. For the child, her last name is what makes
her part of her family, to belong to her parents, and to maintain her identity.
For the Nazis, a Jewish name meant that you were subhuman. Identity is
a very complex thing that has different implications for different people
and Martin approaches it from an interesting perspective.
Questions
for Prof. Mahlendorf: What do you think is the significance of certain
moments that you cannot recall? The amount of detail that you have about
events in your early childhood is amazing, but some, seemingly, mundane
details are forgotten; such as, how you performed at the leadership training
and what made you feel so uncomfortable there, the fourth type of human
being taught by Lotte, etc. Can you discern any type of importance at these
details being forgotten, do they have something in common?
for Josie Levy Martin: At one point, you talk about wanting to give
a crucifix to your parents to protect them from being harmed. How does
that child-like thought and confusion about religion affect you today?
Your parents were being persecuted because they did not believe in Jesus
Christ and there you were wanting to protect them with a Christian religious
symbol. How has that contradiction imposed on you affect your beliefs now?
- From Professor Mahlendorf’s Memoir:
“At least in theory, one’s private life, one’s own personal,
intimate sphere, did not exist for a member of the Hitler Youth. Each member
was required to serve a cause larger than himself or herself, in ceaseless
effort; thus activity triumphed over thought and reflection” (Chapter
4)
This quote stood out to me because it goes along with the basic argument
of the book I am reading for my essay (Adolf Eichmann). The idea that one’s
personal life must be forfeited entirely to a government strikes me.
From Josie Levy Martin:
I found it interesting that when Josie’s father came to visit her
at the convent, she did not even know what religion her parents were. Also,
how hard it must have been for her father to not be able to tell her.
Questions:
For Professor Mahlendorf:
After reading about the Russian soldier who was almost killed at the hospital,
and how you almost went along with it, how far do you think you could have
gone if Nazi Germany had not lost the war?
For Josie Levy Martin:
What ever happened to Mademoiselle Gilberte? And your parents?
- Ursula Malendorf
1. An anecdote I found interesting in the Malendorf reading was Ursula
is explaining the dynamics of the Nazi youth movement and how its propaganda
worked to undermine parents’ authority of their children. The particular
account is when a young Ursula does not ask her mother if she can cut the
fur off of their coats to bring back to the HJ.
“’You didn’t ask me if you could give them away!’
she exclaimed, horrified at this act of independent butchery, and I ran
off, knowing there would be hell to pay when I got back, but I felt heroic.
Mother refused to speak to me for a week, and though her silences terrified
me I was content, knowing that I had done the right thing for the Fuhrer…
The slogan ‘Youth led by youth’ proved a powerful tool, welding
us into what we thought of as comradeship and which was in fact mass manipulation,
down to the smallest unit. We thought of ourselves as different from out
mothers. The HJ gave us different, new ideals and new tasks on behalf of
our nation.”
It is really interesting how Hitler and the leaders of the Nazi movement
realized the importance of capitalizing on the young and impressionable
youth to help advance their cause. By undermining parents from the beginning,
Hitler could make German youth dedicated to his cause without directly
having to do any of the work. He was very smart in outsourcing pride and
commitment to people, working on a hierarchical structure. This made everyone,
even children feel they were an integral part of bigger cause.
2. Did the Nazi’s use a different kind of propaganda that was
more effective in furthering their cause? They seem to be extrodinarily
successful, especially compared to other propaganda movements in different
repressive regimes.
Josie Martin:
1. One of the anecdotes I found most interesting in this reading was when
Josie was recalling how her mother told her she was not Christian, but
would not tell her what religion she practiced.
“’I’ve told you, we do not go into church. Church is
not for us…I, we do not believe in Jesus. Jesus is the Christian’s
God. We don’t follow him. We are not Christians.’” She
said it as if it was bad to be Christian. ‘What are we then?’
The child demanded an answer. ‘We are…we are a different religion’
Here Maman bit her lip and looked helpless and miserable. ‘What is
it that we are?’ ‘Stop it! Stop asking me things you don’t
need to know.’
I find this insightful because I never realized at what point in my life
I started to understand the concept of religion. I cant remember a time
when I didn’t know I was Jewish. I sympathize with the struggle that
Josie’s parents must have endured not telling their daughter she
was Jewish. It was too help guard her from herself and her own identity
in a way.
2. Did the Nuns in the school try to convert Josie? If so, did her parents
know this was a condition of leaving her in the care of the nuns? Was this
practiced in all covenants that hide Jewish children?
- Ursula Mahlendorf- Chapter 5- A particular part I found quite profound,
insightful, as well as disturbing was when Mahlendorf received her first
lecture about intercourse and impregnation by her HJ cadre leader, Lotte
in a middle school classroom. Lotte tells the fourteen-year-old girls that
their future function will be to “enjoy having many children for
the Führer” and that is why they also must remain pure. Furthermore,
Lotte then uses a violent metaphor to end her sex talk saying that, “When
your future husband makes you a mother, he will put his member into you
like a sword thrusts itself into its sheath and his seed will impregnate
the ovum in your belly.” This part of Mahendorf’s memoir really
shows the extent of Nazism as it invaded even the most private and confusing
time of a young woman’s life. It served to brainwash these girls
to be scared of sex and to only have it in the name of Hitler, expressing
the ideology of woman only having sex for the purpose of creating new generations
of Aryans and not for personal pleasure. Moreover, the sex talk provides
the Nazi thinking of women being subservient to the German man’s
sexual and social dominance while disregarding any need for emotional intimacy
and affection. .
Question- Other than the German fairytales and folklore, what other
instances do you remember from your days in the Hitler Youth that were
so distorted through Nazi perversion that it still makes you uncomfortable
to think about?
Josie Martin- In her chapter Trysts, Martin recalls when Mademoiselle
Gilberte left her among the grasses on the river bank while Gilberte read
her “book” which was actually her boyfriend Fritz. Martin is
confused and too young to realize what exactly was happening between Gilberte
and Fritz in the woods while she plays amongst the flowers and observes
the sighs, groans, smells, and movements in the thickets of the forest.
But one night when Martin was suppose to be sleeping she overhears an argument
between the couple which inspires her to try and help Gilberte understand
as they are walking home. After telling Gilberte what Fritz was saying,
Gilberte yells at Martin and hit her. To stop Martin from crying, Gilberte
then makes a deal with her to never tell anyone that she hit her for a
sugar cube everyday in return. This chapter illustrates Martin’s
disillusionment with her surroundings as her innocence and ignorance are
clearly exemplified through her confusion about the French Catholic teacher/Germany
soldier relationship. Furthermore, her ability to keep secrets also emphasizes
this point with her not telling anyone her last name and not telling about
Gilberte striking her. She knows keeping secrets are for her benefit but
does not grasp the shear realities of breaking them.
Question- What inspired you to write your book from a third person perspective?
Did you start writing it that way or change after you started the book?
- Events/Anecdotes:
1. I did not know that local Catholic diocese played a role in rescuing
Jewish children from the internment camps, but thought that it was more
of a private effort on the part of local citizens.
2. I found it interesting how Nazi ideology and “working towards
the Fuhrer” influenced how sex and motherhood was taught to young
girls which seems like something mothers should teach their daughters rather
than HJ leaders. The number of children you have or want should determined
by the couple and not the state.
Questions:
1. How extensive was the Catholic Church’s effort to save Jewish
children or was it left up to local priests and bishops? Did you know any
other children, whom you may have met after the war, who were rescued on
the part of local churches?
2. As the war turned against Germany in 1944 and 1945 and manpower shortages
increased how were girls in the HJ used to fill in the gaps on the home
front and how were these tasks different than in the previous four years
of the war?
- Ursula Mahlendorf
I find it interesting that the Hitler Youth made boys and girls equal in
activities and privileges. This seems to be a progressive thought for the
time and a real opportunity for the girls involved and to make something
of themselves in Nazi society.
Since Hitler youth was seen as preparation for adulthood, what were
the main ideologies taught for women? What was expected of women growing
up in this fashion?
Josie Martin
Josie is hidden in a convent and in return for protection, she helps out
around the convent. I had never heard of collaboration between Jewish people
and Catholic establishments for protection. This must have been a real
advantage and interesting experience for her to learn about another religion.
Why is the book written in the third person? Why are certain words and
phrases italicized in the book as well? Is there meaning behind this writing
style and format?
- Mahlendorf: The anecdote related about marching and singing in Hitler’s
Youth provided keen insight into what it must have been like to be part
of such an organized and inclusive experience. The idea of singing “And
our banner leads us into eternity! Our banner is greater than death!”
led by an older girl, the squadron, makes one see how having enthusiasm
for such a cause could be so possible during Hitler’s reign. The
united cause, being with young people your own age, and singing for a purpose
would definitely have an appeal to youth today, and it makes it hard to
blame youth for joining an atrocious unjust cause because of such brainwashing
tactics.
Are you still in contact/were you with girls who were part of the Hitler
Youth along with you? Do you wish that you could have had your childhood
back instead of sacrificing it for the Hitler Youth?
Martin: An anecdote that really touched me in her writings was the part
when her mother and father informed her that she would have to take a different
last name, L’Or, meaning gold. This alias, which enchanted her very
much because of childhood fantasies of Rapunzel, was very touching and
insightful into the mind of a child. The idea of future isolation and not
being with ones parents/knowing that change is taking place, in a child’s
eye can be eclipsed by a childlike mind. I thought sweet anecdotes such
as this bring such innocence to the story and also represent the innocence
of so many children who experienced WWII in Europe, especially Jewish children.
The censoring of the truth by her parents represents how horrendous the
events of the war truly were because parents had to create stories to conceal
their children from the evil that was taking place and block the reality
of the situation from them.
How long did you keep the alias L’Or? Would you have rather to
be told the truth at the time of departure from your parents? Were you
ever in contact with the sister(nun) who helped you after the war?
- 1. Two events/anecdotes
-Mahlendorf:
During the war, in an effort to clothe German soldiers fighting during
Russia’s winter, Ursula takes the fur from her and her mother’s
coats. Much to her mother’s opposition, Ursula values her image as
a supporter of Hitler’s war over her mother’s judgment. Ursula’s
actions demonstrate that loyalty to Hitler and his movement was superior
to familial ties. The Hitler Youth inspired rebellion against parents and
a new importance for youth to the country.
-Martin:
While at the convent, Josie goes on walks with Mademoiselle Gilberte and
witnesses the meeting between Mademoiselle and a German soldier. Josie
immediately associates their meeting as an act of collaboration, something
she knows as wrong. Collaboration with the enemy was taught even to the
younger generations as an act not to be committed. Even at such a young
age Josie knows the meeting between Mademoiselle and the German soldier
is illegal.
2. Two questions:
-Mahlendorf:
How did your relationships with family members change as your progressed
in the Hitler Youth?
-Martin:
Who taught you that collaboration was an act to be frowned upon?
- 1. Insight –
I thought that the idea to incorporate girls into the Hitler Youth was
not only liberating for the young women, but a brilliant idea on account
of Hitler and the Nazi Party. Especially at the adolescent age, girls strive
to “spread their wings” away from the confines of their families.
Mahlendorf puts it perfectly when she says that “the Jungmädel
made her feel as valuable as her brother”. The Hitler Youth made
it possible for women to reach equality with men (or at least more equality
than they had ever seen). This was a rewarding and remarkable experience
for these ladies to partake in for the time. Mahlendorf’s insight
shows what it was really like to be captured with so many positive aspects
of nationalism and womanhood.
In excerpt by Josie Martin, I thought it was shocked to hear about
a Jesuit priest that rescued Jewish children from concentration camps and
took them in hiding. I did not know about this act of non-Jewish resistance,
and was thrilled to read about the rescued. However, it was strange how
the nun was so forceful on the Jewish child. It shows that everyone considered
Christianity as the dominant religion. From the way the nun treated the
child it conveyed that even the rescuers thought that misbehavior and disrespect
was common among Jewish children.
2. Questions –
Mahlendorf: What was it like to be a member of the Hitler Youth? When
did you realize that the Hitler Youth was a racist and political organization?
Was it heartbreaking?
Martin: What was it like being a child of the holocaust with your parents
taken away to concentration camps?
- In Josie Martin’s memoir, the most striking episode for me was
when the two boys show Josie and her friends the dead Nazi. The Nazis seem
so threatening before this, but as the body is described to the reader,
you see it as a child. This benign representation is augmented by the choice
of comparison—she describes the Nazi as “younger than cousin
Robaire.” This not only makes him seem as a child, it also engenders
a familiarity with him.
The lucidity with which she describes the feelings of a child at such a
traumatic point is also astounding. Leading up to the climax, where they
see the soldier, Martin describes the preoccupation with fear and the fears
of others knowing you are scared. This reminded me of how I felt during
“scary” situations when I was a child. How one could remember
and effectively communicate those childhood feelings from the 1940’s
is astounding to me.
In Professor Mahlendorf’s memoir, the part I found particularly enlightening
was the description of the Nazi’s use of German literature and folk
music. The use of music and literature in creating a volkgheist is a big
interest of mine, but I had not thought about how these cultural products
would affect a person who carried a large amount of guild along with the
national identity. Mahlendorf says, “Like many intellectuals of my
generation, after the Nazi defeat I would never again want to read a fairytale
or Germanic saga, nor could I tolerate a folk proverb or folksong except
in a satirical context.” She also states that she still feels uncomfortable
when she hears German folksongs. It should not be surprising that such
strong emotions can be attached to music or literature, but reading it
from a firsthand account makes it feel much more real in a sense.
My question for Josie Martin is: After reading the Tea Fire article
and about your experience with survivor’s guilt, what responsibilities,
if any, do you feel that survivors of the holocaust have?
My question to Professor Mahlendorf is: You write about being uncomfortable
with folk music and other nationalist forms of media. Does hyper-nationalism
in media, such as post-September 11th country music, in general make you
uncomfortable, or would you say that it is confined to German nationalism?
- In the Martin text, the relationship of a nun and a German soldier
is particularly striking, since nuns were forbidden from any form of intimacy
with others. The fact that it was an enemy made it even more so. It is
an event of note because in going to the convent Josie was told she would
be safe from the enemy. Seeing one near the convent can make one think
that the place is not as safe as some think it is. It would probably cause
alarm seeing one’s enemy in a place they thought was safe from them.
The fact that the nun was intimate with him also shows that religion isn’t
as sacred as one would like to think. It is also important to see that
Josie’s finding out, her getting punched and bribed, and her bleeding
from the mouth at the end puts her on the spot of either sinning by lying
or telling the truth and the other nun getting found out. She had previously
been taught not to lie by her mother. Her answer to the nun can demonstrate
whether she will be true to her mother’s teachings or if she is somehow
being corrupted by events in the convent.
Possible Question- How widespread was the hiding of Jewish children
and other refugees in convents and similar places done in the name of their
protection, and if so how influential were their experiences in their lives
after the war?
In the Mahlendorf text, her frictions with her mother are an important
note, as it shows a couple of things. One is the generation gap, as her
mother seems to frown on what she is doing and becoming. It is an example
of the emphasis of Nazism and fascism in general that the state transcends
any individual person and that service to the state is more important than
anything else. It also shows how effective the propaganda she’s exposed
to really is, which is the primary reason for the lack of understanding
between them. She is willing to do anything that is needed to help Germany
in the war effort.
Possible Question- Why at times does the author feel like part of a
group and at others like she is all alone during her time in the HJ?
- Two Events:
- Ursula Mahlendorf: I found it particularly interesting that Professor
Mahlendorf hated her mother's apparent political apathy yet also states
that had her mother tried to dissaude her from participating in the HJ,
it would probably have only entrenched her commitment to it.
- Josie Martin: I thought it was interesting that Josie happened to
discover one of the nuns collaborating with a german even though it was
clearly against the rules. Later when one of the nuns finds blood on josie's
pillow, josie is torn between keeping the nun's secret and telling the
other nun why her lip was bleeding.
Two Questions:
- Ursula Mahlendorf: Do you believe that there was something your parents
or family could've done to stop the indoctrination you were subjected to
as a child and young adult?
- Ursula Mahlendorf’s Memoir:
Mahlendorf described the Breslau Meet she participated in with Hitler
Youth in 1941. During the ceremonies she described how one of the flag
bearers fainted and she was asked to take her place. The excitement of
being chosen quickly fades as she has difficulty not fainting herself.
Then the speaker announces that German troops have begun to move against
the Soviet Union. I found it interesting that despite her physical discomfort
and all of the propaganda instilled in her by the Hitler Youth, Ursula
Mahlendorf still immediately questioned the move against the Soviet Union.
Josie Levy Martin’s Memoir:
In the chapter entitled “Crosses” Martin describes the terror
she felt for her parents because they didn’t have crosses in their
home and she was worried about how they could be protected without them.
Josie makes a cross out of cardboard to send to her parents and prays it
will be enough to protect them from “the boches and the bombs.”
The anecdote demonstrates the helplessness and fear she and many others
experienced but is especially poignant because it is mixed with the innocence
of a child.
Questions:
For Ursula Mahlendorf: In the introduction you talked about how you
have since come to the realization that by thirteen and fourteen you had
begun to rebel against the conformity of the Hitler Youth, in what ways?
For Josie Martin: What was happening with your parents while you were
at the convent?
- 1. An event that I found particularly insightful from Ms. Martin’s
work is when she is a child and her parents tell her that she is to be
sent to a boarding school at a convent. She is given a new name and says,”
But if you don’t have the same last name, then I cannot be your little
girl anymore?” (Martin 26). I found this passage insightful because
it truly shows the length that many Jews had to go to in order to survive.
It is one thing to run and hide from an oppressive power but, in my opinion,
it is far more traumatizing to have to change one’s own identity
and continue living amongst people who would gladly cause you harm if they
knew the truth. The uncertainty of everyday life must have been quite difficult
and this is a perspective I had hardly considered before.
An event that I found insightful from Ms. Mahlendorf’s work is
when she states,” At age ten, when I heard him and my HJ leaders
call us “his Hitler Youth,” I understood that phrase literally.
I was his, as I was my mother’s child”. I found this piece
exceptionally insightful because I am doing my report on the Hitler Youth
and it is something that has always fascinated me. She is proof that even
the children of the era were looking for a leader to believe in and follow.
This also show’s Hitler’s ability to capture a large demographic
and have them do his bidding.
2. A question I would like to ask Ms. Martin is how did being submersed
in a completely different religion, shape your view of the Holocaust?
A question I would ask Ms. Mahlendorf is how difficult was it to resist
joining the Hitler Youth? Also, was there a great amount of pressure from
friends and family to join?
- 1.
a. From one of her Memoirs, Mahlendorf explains the procedures that enforced
in the Hitler Youth program. It included four month of administrative work,
two month in leadership programs, a year of study, experience in industry
work and a final examination. I find this particularly insightful because
it shows how brainwashing could have occurred during the time of Hitler
Youth. All these activities and training done to the children part of the
organization must have served as a tool for brainwashing. It shows why
obedience was key in those times especially because some of the tasks imposed
on Germans were horrible, nevertheless they were still done, brain washing
had worked.
b.
Looking at anti-semitism and looking at the memoirs of witnesses that were
just children or teenagers in those horrific times, you can see what kind
of impact these events must have had on Children's lives at this time.
FIrstly, we can see that Children in the era of the Holocaust must have
been extra mature in order to survive, they needed to act accordingly to
the situation, as opposed to their age. In chapter 4, we see the memoir
of an Austrian Jew that was very young in 1938 and how she could hear soldiers
march outside her house yelling "Jewish Blood". I just cannot
imagine how i would have felt in these times, being so young and hearing
this outside my house, knowing that Jews are being racially discriminated,
killed, and treated horribly. It just really shows how children had to
take on themselves, and just like Josie Martin said, "to never show
your emotions".
Questions that i would ask them:
1.Was there at any points when Jews wanted to revolt against the Nazis
knowing that they might be sent to concentration camps or be executed?
2.In the Jewish community, Rabbis are the highest moral figures, i wanted
to know what kind of things they told the younger ones? did you pray a
lot? Were there any Jews that lost faith because of what was going on?
- 1. A. I found it very interesting that Josie’s mother was quick
to denounce the Christian faith, but equally hesitant to tell Josie that
they were Jewish. She was obviously doing her best to protect Josie from
revealing their religion to outsiders, but she could not help herself from
defending her faith and making sure that Josie knew they were not Christian.
This put Josie in a very awkward situation since she was studying at a
Catholic school and was obviously too young to realize the grander implications
of her religion. She had a natural child’s instinct, however, to
know that something was amiss.
B. Despite knowing the great lengths the Nazis went to maintain organization
and discipline, I was still taken aback by the fact that they were training
young girls in the Hitler Youth as though they were men in training for
the military. The teacher makes Ursula and her classmates count out loud,
then march in formation and then learn songs. This despite the fact that
the Nazis were training young girls in “health, child care, domestic
skills, and self-improvement in preparation for motherhood”. This
task, seemingly completely unrelated to motherhood, helped the young girls
develop patriotism and loyalty to Germany and the Nazi party.
Question 1: Josie, how is it that you can recollect everything in such
vivid detail despite being so young at the time?
Question 2: Professor Mahlendorf, how much of the information regarding
the Hitler Youth did you know in the 1930s? Was any of the information
in your memoirs regarding Hitler’s plans for the Youth public information?
- 1. Two Events
a. I found Professor Mahlendorf’s accounts of activity within the
Hitler Jugend to be particularly interesting. It shows the simple things
that can be done to affect the decisions of children, such as camping events
and group activities. It in a way resembles the Boyscouts with their outings,
value system, community service projects, and yet it can be used for such
malevolent means as fueling the Nazi regime.
b. In Josie Martin’s accounts I found it fairly touching when the
child was so concerned with the protection of her family that she was looking
for crosses everywhere, thinking that if her parents didn’t have
a cross with them, Jesus would not protect them. Just the innocence of
thought stuck out, the view of the world through a child’s eyes.
2. Questions
a. At the time it was a social program that seemed like it was helping
people and bringing people together, do you feel that all aspects of the
Hitler Jugend was bad? (Mahlendorf)
b. Is the Convent-school still standing? (Martin)
- 1. “I believe that my experience has particular relevance for
the world of 2005 as now, again, countries everywhere embark on ideological,
military and ethnic cleansing adventures like the ones that led my country
of origin along such a destructive course.”
While the entire piece of writing was terribly interesting and moving,
I found the closing sentence extremely interesting and insightful. It made
me realise that history really does repeat itself on regular occasions,
such as Slobodan Milosevic’s Serbia and Soeharto’s Indonesia.
While Hitler’s Germany was not the first instance of ideological,
military and ethnic cleansing, it has (arguably) been the most significant
and examined in all of modern history. I very much enjoyed reading the
piece, as it illustrated the ways in which people of certain social groups
were persecuted, due to an ideology of a certain leader. Further, it also
made me realise how well Hitler was able to indoctrinate youth and the
population as a whole. The fact that it was written by a living witness,
an actual primary source, adds emotion to the piece.
You noted that “Hitler gradually became an idealized substitute
father for [you]”. Do you feel that the thousands of other youth
in Hitler youth had the same feeling due to his charisma?
2. Something I found insightful in the anecdote Tant Pis, was the sense
of abandonment that the child felt. She felt abandoned by mademoiselle
and it was an unexplainable abandonment for her. The fact we are not told
where or why mademoiselle has gone gives us an insight into the bemusement
with which the child feels. Since the child also doesn’t understand
the phrase ‘Tant Pis’ we see this child- like all children-
lacks the ability to understand the adult world and thus answer the question,
“why would mademoiselle go?”
The first question I would ask the author is where did Mademoiselle
go?
The second is did you grow up in a similar environment to the one mentioned
in the story?
- 1. One aspect of the Mahlendorf reading I found quite insightful was
the all encompassing nature of Hitler’s Youth. Mahlendorf explains
how once the war started Kids were taken away from their schools and family
to help the harvest and in military duties. Once a member of Hitler’s
Youth kids belonged to the organization. The motto which bound them was
the idea of “you are either for us or against us” this striped
children of their individuality in his words they no longer existed. The
children were taught to idolize Hitler as a father and to let go of their
personal private life. This was reinforced through Nazi ideological readings
in school and altered German folk tales. There was an emphasis on molding
kids to become part of the system.
2. My question would be how hard was it for children who had been indoctrinated
for so long to let go of Nazi ideologies and see the lies which attempted
to control them. Were children more likely to cling to Nazi philosophies
than adults who had been part of the party?
3. The one event I thought was insightful in Martin’s story was
when Josie had to go away to the covenant and change her name. This was
a very emotional time for the family and it shows the hard choices Jewish
family’s had to make at this time. Josie’s parents knew that
by sending her away she would survive but they were losing their daughter
in presence, name and religion. I can only imagine what it would be like
to make that decision. It was also interesting to see the importance of
a name and the pain it caused Josie and her parents when they were forced
to change it. The parents knew that there was a possibility they could
be killed and their child would grow with a completely different faith
and view than the one they held.
4. My question would be what was the hardest part about living away
from your family and living around people of a completely different culture
and religion?
- After reading Josie Martin’s, “Never Tell Your Name”
I found one particular passage insightful and revealing. When Josie’s
parents are sending her away to a Nun school, I thought the way that the
situation was handled was interesting. First of all the fact they are sending
her away shows the seriousness of the situation even in a country like
France. They also give her a new last name, which is a life changing experience
for Josie. A little girl is forced to change her identity so that she can
assimilate to the culture and hide her religion. Her parents try to hide
all of this from her by telling her that she is going to a “convent-
school where there other little girls like you.” I had heard of families
sending their children away to other friends or family’s homes many
times but sending a child to a sleep away school and having them change
their name was a first for me.
Question for Josie: When did you begin to feel comfortable speaking about
your experiences of the Holocaust?
Ursula Mahlendorf offers a different position then Josie Martin. She is
on the Nazi side as a child. Her entire commentary is insightful but to
me what is most interesting is how the Nazi party was able to maximize
all of its resources, even a ten-year-old girl. By having her go to her
family and emptying her family’s closets for the war effort shows
how dedicated a young child was for the Nazi party. The way the Nazi party
did this did not surprise me though; it was very well thought out and manipulative.
They were able to create the Hitler Youth and indoctrinated them with Nazi
propaganda. By teaching them about Nazi leaders, having them recite poems
and memorizing songs they cultivated the youth in their support.
Question for Ursula: How have Jews reacted/ responded to you when they
found out about your involvement with the Nazi party?
- 1. Mahlendorf
The story Mahlendorf tells about getting the fur from her coats is an
event I find insightful. Mahlendorf was so devoted to the causes preached
by the youth group she was willing to act independently, chopping the fur
off clothes. She writes that she was content with herself even though she
had angered mother because she had “done the right thing for the
Führer.” This paragraph demonstrates to me how effective the
HJ was in engraining the Nazi ideology into the hearts and minds of children.
Mahlendorf is emotionally tied to the Reich and thinks for the betterment
of the state above all else, even family. Mahlendorf’s want and need
to please her youth leader and Hitler shows the effectiveness of mass manipulation
under the youth programs. Mahlendorf’s coat story and her feeling
of heroism for disobeying her mother helps readers to understand the powerful
effect youth programs had.
Q: Do you think the youth program would have affected you so deeply
if you had not lost your father when you were young? How much of the HJ’s
success was based in portraying Hitler as a heroic, father figure?
2. Josie Martin
One event that stuck out to me in Josie’s story is when her Mom
tells her that she is of a different religion, but will not tell Josie
that she is Jewish. This goes along with Josie’s thought when she
is around Fritz, the German soldier. She has learned the less she speaks,
the safer she is. This combination of events provides insight to the internal
struggle many Jews had to endure when hiding who they truly were. The mother
is willing to deny her child her true identity in order to protect her.
Reading this account helps me to understand the difficulties people had
to endure to remember who they are. To endure and remain Jewish is an amazing
feat and the struggle of a child to remember her parents, her heritage,
and pain and not to simply let it go shows the strength of the human spirit.
Q: Looking back on your childhood and how the war turned out, how do
you feel about the decision your parents made to send you away? How hard
was it for you to stay true to your Jewish heritage and remember your family?
- 1) One event that I found interesting in the Josie Levy Martin section
took place in the Chapter Rocks. The little girl and “Mademoiselle
were walking through the forest towards the old mill when the older woman
hurts her toe on a rock on the trail. She goes to soak it in the water
but is confronted by what seem to be revolutionary forces. They stop mademoiselle
and curse her as a “boches-Nazi” and harshly warn the little
child to avoid associating herself with the “woman and her friends.
I thought this was an important anecdote in that it is rare to read a younger
child’s interpretation of “the world at war”. For several
years, children that were born or lived in wartime probably knew very little
of what was going around them and misinterpreted the events of the day,
especially in the later years.
In the later years and up until the very end of the war, how were people
able to pick out Nazi collaborators and what actions would one take to
avoid being reported?
2) An event that I thought was worthy of note was the day after Crystal
Night when young Mrs. Mahlendorf went to school and several of her classmates
were missing. When she asks what happened to them the teacher tells her
to be quiet and that “The Gerstels and Eva’s parents had gone
abroad”. I thought this was important because just like the first
one, many of the children did not realize this anti-Jewish ideology until
years after the initial violence began. As Professor Mahlendorf explains,
“Jews as living people disappeared from my experience and became
an abstraction”.
In your introduction you say that you became a professor in order to
speak “about my experience so as to make my students and young people
understand how seductive any ideology, nationalism and militarism can be
–not just Nazism-- and where they can lead you”. What is it
that you found particularly interesting or enticing about Nazism. What
drew you in to become such a dedicated German before and during the war?
- 1.
Josie Martin’s insightful scene: When her parents take her to the
convent and her father says “As we can no longer protect her, this
is what we must do to save her.” This reveals to the reader what
parents, especially Jewish parents, must have been going through during
this time. They knew what was going on, and what would be going on, with
the Nazis and their only problem was finding a way to save their children
even if they never saw them again.
Ursula Mahlendorf’s insightful scene: When she takes the furs
from her house even though her mother told her not to. She said that by
taking the furs to give to the soldiers, she felt heroic and knew that
she had done the right thing for the Fuhrer. This reveals how passionate
the members of Hitler Youth and other Nazi groups were in helping the Fuhrer;
that they were willing to do anything and go against anyone if it helped
in achieving the Fuhrer’s wishes.
2.
Question for Josie Martin: How long did you have to pretend that you were
Christian?
Question for Ursula Mahlendorf: How high did you move up in the Hitler
Youth and what were your responsibilities?
- The Hitler Youth indoctrinated its children with the ideology of the
party but also with German culture. Mahlendorf describes how she read German
folk tales, myths, and heroic epics. Mahlendorf states that to this day
hearing German folk songs makes her uncomfortable. I found this to be very
interesting because it illustrates how the Hitler Youth sought to indoctrinate
the German youth in all aspects of their life. A tremendous amount of value,
importance, and pride was placed on the German "Aryan" culture.
I was struck by the authors description of the little girl taking notice
of all the crosses in the convent. As a young girl, Josie notices that
there is at least one cross in every room and that every person wears a
cross as well. She wonders why her parents don't have a cross at home and
she worries about them because they do not have a cross so Jesus can not
protect them. She is very determined to get her parents a cross so she
eventually makes one for them so that they will be safe. This story was
interesting to me because it reminded me how young Josie was and how confusing
the entire situation must have been for such a small girl. The words 'Christian'
and 'Jew' do not mean anything to such a young girl, and yet they will
have a dramatic impact on her life.
Questions:
1. For Prof. Mahlendorf: In your memoir, you state that Hitler became a
substitute father figure for you and that he was portrayed to the Hitler
Youth as a father figure- How did you view Hitler? What about him attracted
you? Did you feel a personal connection with him?
2. For Josie Martin: You were sent to the convent at such a young age-
How aware were you of the danger your parents were in? How much did you
comprehend what was happening to the Jews of France at the time?
- 1a) I felt Josie was extremely insightful when it came to the secret
meetings between mademoiselle and the German soldier Fritz. Despite her
not understanding the magnitude of the repercussion’s mademoiselle
would face if caught she did realize you were not supposed to be friends
with the Germans. This eventually played out to her benefit when she was
struck in the face by mademoiselle when she brought up the situation with
her; she got sugar cubes, which were very rare, and now had leverage on
mademoiselle. The fact that she even had a slight conception of her wrong
doing impressed me and showed that she wasn’t just a naive little
girl.
1b) The Ceremony Professor Mahlendorf attended towards the beggining
of her Hitler Youth years. The type of propaganda she was exposed to really
showed how the youth were indoctrinated with Hitler's messege. As she stated
it began to take over her life when she was told they all must do their
part to win the war. It's interesting hearing a persons perspective on
how Hitler's views were engraved into peoples minds from the inside. Obviously
it's easy for many people to say how could you follow such an evil man,
but when it is presented in this way it sheds some light on this. The sheer
size of the gathering alone is something to marval at when you are a child,
then along with the province leader's mass malipulation proved to have
a tremendous effect on a niave child's mind.
2a) Question for Josie: The transition to the convent school was not
spoken of much, how long was the trip there? Did your father drive you
in his beloved Peugeot or did someone else have to drive you there? Was
it extremely emotional or had you come to terms with the situation?
2b) Question for Professor Mahlendorf: The day following crystal night,
did most people react in the same manner as your teacher? Did they all
elude your questions and inquisitions as to what had happened and why?
(I read chapter 3 also and this question is from that, since we just talked
about this)
- 1.Chapter 4 of professor Mahlendorf's memoir discusses the dedication
of the home front to the Nazi war effort. Half way through the chapter
she recalls having to go door to door collecting recyclables and scraps
once a week for four years. I had to read that at least twice to make sure
I was not mistaken. In 1940 she was ten years old. She also writes that
the entire city was ran by old people and fourteen to eighteen year olds.
The paragraphs she takes to describe the sacrifices made on behalf of the
German people were particularly striking to me.
From Josie Martin's memoir, I thought the chapter and the descriptions
of the crosses were very insightful. She didn't know that she was raised
Jewish because she did not know anything else. She describes passing a
church and asking her mother if she could go inside to see the stained
glass. Her mother responded sharply reminding her that Jesus was the Christian's
god, not theirs. At the Catholic school she has to keep her Jewish identity
a secret and learn proper Catholic etiquette. Her description of the cross
she made her parents shows the impressionable yet innocent mentality of
a child through those harsh times.
2. Mahlendorf: Was is difficult returning to school after the war? Did
you have any fears/anxieties about being German when you arrived in the
United States?
Martin: What role did religiosity play in your formative years at the
convent, was spirituality important to you throughout the war?
- It is interesting in Professor Mahlendorf’s memoir about how
the Hitler youth especially the women having a freer and less restricted
life. It was an opportunity that previous generations had not gotten to
experience as women. The young women could also compete in sports and most
activities boys did. They were also fully included when spoke to by a party
leader. Also that Hitler placed the Hitler Youth in the heart of the police
state. This is a very interesting take because I never would have thought
that the Hitler Youth was anything more than young boys and to think that
they had some equality is a monumental stance. It is really insightful
to read brief instances of goodwill and hope that was given to the youth
by Hitler. Hitler also putting a lot of emphasis on youth is a good thing
even though in the end it was just to use propaganda to get them fully
committed to the cause. I know a lot of things he planned or his leaders
planned were bad but this is one instance where it was beneficial especially
for women. To think the Nazi party was able to give new experiences to
young German women that had given to previous generations is remarkable.
Professor Mahlendorf, Was anti-Semitism reinforced during your time
in Hitler Youth? What was mentioned on radio stations other than laws?
When Josie’s mother talks about how they do not go to church and
they do not believe in Jesus because he is the Christian’s God and
we are no Christians. I think this is an important event because Josie
had seen all about crosses and that religion in the covenant but her mom
is embarrassed to talk about their religion which I am going to assume
is Judaism. This is an important event that I found insightful that although
Josie is forced to lie about her name and go to an area of Christian belief,
she is not allowed to follow that religion because she is Jewish. I think
its odd as well that her mother would not tell her that she is a Jew when
she asks even if she is young. Her mom knew the negative connotation of
how Jews were treated and I guess did not want her to be subjected to that
kind of situation.
How do you respond to people that try to claim that the Holocaust never
happened?
- Ursula Mahlendorf:
1) What I found very interesting in Mahlendorf's reading is the part where
she writes that even the Hitler Youths participated in the street fighting
of the early 1930's, and if one of them died they would often be presented
as a martyr. Mahlendorf writes of one such individual that was celebrated
in a city through a sentimental novel and movie. I find this interesting
because it shows the depth the Nazi party was going with propaganda to
gain peoples trust and belief.
2) I would like to ask Mahlendorf:
In the novels and films that that presented Hitler Youths as martyrs after
they would die in a street fight, what was the effect of these on the general
public in Germany? How often would a new story like this be presented to
the public? And was there a certain time during the Nazi regime when these
stories began to pick up and appear more commonly?
Josie Martin:
1) I find the event of Josie being placed in a covenant for her own safety
very intriguing. I have always wondered how common it was for Jewish people
to pretend not to be of Jewish faith in order to survive. I find Josie's
story very interesting because it explains the depth her parents and she
went through to keep herself safe. The fact that she had to change her
name and keep such a big secret was a big risk I feel for her parents to
keep her safe.
2) I would like to ask Josie Martin:
Looking back, do you think there is a chance any of the other girls at
the covenant might of been hiding something to keep safe? And how often
do you think a case similar to yours happened in Europe?
- In Ursula Mahlendorf’s book, I found the fact that she is still
feels uncomfortable when she hears German folksongs very interesting. Because
German Romantic literature and culture was used as propoganda and ways
to increase blind patriotism of the Hitler Youth, she associated it with
“Nazi pervesion.” Songs, books, and other pieces of culture
remind people of the time they heard or read them, or when they were problem.
It is usually a trigger in our memory, a relic of the past. For Mahlendorf,
it is a reminder of Nazi brainwash and manipulation.
Question: After the war, when did you first start to realize the enormity
of what Hitler and the Nazi Party had done and seeing past the Hitler Youth
point of view?
One part that struck me was on page 39, when Josie Martin describes
how as a child, she looked to Jesus to protect her parents. Since they
were being targeted as Jews, she looks to another religion for safety.
She makes a paper cross and performs the sign of the cross. She sees it
as a safe haven, because disguising as a Christian will indeed keep her
safe.
Question: Why did you choose to write your memoirs in third-person,
and from multiple perspectives, not just your own? Does this convey your
story differently than if you had written in first-person narrative?
- Event #1: From Ch. 3 Mahlendorf:
"'It’s not like that at all,’" another man said.
"'Nobody is shouting for war. Look at the people!’" True,
nobody was enthusiastic and shouted "Sieg Heil, " as I had heard
it on the radio when Austria and the Sudentenland joined the Reich. The
crowd on the platform was anxious, as impatient to get home as I was. The
adults’ faces were grim, lined with worry.
I found this anecdote insightful and fascinating because it contradicts
everything that popular history tells us. From what we read in mass produced
textbooks and see in movies, it’s hard not to envision German’s
in the days leading up to WWII as nationalistic zealots anxiously ready
for war. Despite the knowledge I have of the German people (from classes
like yours and others, and independent readings) it always shocks me at
some level to read anecdotal references like this one. Yes the crowd was
“anxious,” but not for war; rather they were anxious of the
uncertainty war would bring.
Event #2: From Josie Levy’s “Never Tell Your Name.”
(37).
“She is sick. Sick with longing for her mother, for her father, for
the too small cozy bed with the cloud blanket, for the morning water, and
for her chocolate cup with the dancing bears circling around the edge…
And now there is something else. She is afraid for her parents who live
in a home where there is not a single cross to protect them.”
This passage to me was deeply moving and opened a window into the mind
of a young Jewish girl living through WWII. By reading that Josie is sick
with longing for her blanket and water and the little things in her life
that she values more than anything in the world, we begin to understand
the loss of innocence that arose as a product of Nazism. Reading that Josie
worries for her parents, who do not have a cross to protect them, we can
see the tragic naivety of youth. Josie, unable to perceive what is going
on around her politically due to her young age, remains concerned for her
parents and believes that a cross may protect them, staying up at night
wondering how to get one for them. The tragic innocence portrayed in this
anecdote is emotionally compelling and revealing of the times.
Question #1: For Ursula Mahlendorf:
In Ch. 3 of your memoir you say and I quote: “I still object when
contemporary German official publications, without referring to and explaining
that infamous history, claim as their own the intellectuals and artists
Germany disowned under Nazism.”
Why do you feel the publications continue to ignore the past? And will
this process of denial ever stop?
Question #2: For Josie Levy:
What made you decide to write in the third person? Was it easier this way
for you to reflect on your emotions and cope with your past?
- Event #1: From Ch. 3 Mahlendorf:
"'It’s not like that at all,’" another man said.
"'Nobody is shouting for war. Look at the people!’" True,
nobody was enthusiastic and shouted "Sieg Heil, " as I had heard
it on the radio when Austria and the Sudentenland joined the Reich. The
crowd on the platform was anxious, as impatient to get home as I was. The
adults’ faces were grim, lined with worry.
I found this anecdote insightful and fascinating because it contradicts
everything that popular history tells us. From what we read in mass produced
textbooks and see in movies, it’s hard not to envision German’s
in the days leading up to WWII as nationalistic zealots anxiously ready
for war. Despite the knowledge I have of the German people (from classes
like yours and others, and independent readings) it always shocks me at
some level to read anecdotal references like this one. Yes the crowd was
“anxious,” but not for war; rather they were anxious of the
uncertainty war would bring.
Event #2: From Josie Levy’s “Never Tell Your Name.”
(37).
“She is sick. Sick with longing for her mother, for her father, for
the too small cozy bed with the cloud blanket, for the morning water, and
for her chocolate cup with the dancing bears circling around the edge…
And now there is something else. She is afraid for her parents who live
in a home where there is not a single cross to protect them.”
This passage to me was deeply moving and opened a window into the mind
of a young Jewish girl living through WWII. By reading that Josie is sick
with longing for her blanket and water and the little things in her life
that she values more than anything in the world, we begin to understand
the loss of innocence that arose as a product of Nazism. Reading that Josie
worries for her parents, who do not have a cross to protect them, we can
see the tragic naivety of youth. Josie, unable to perceive what is going
on around her politically due to her young age, remains concerned for her
parents and believes that a cross may protect them, staying up at night
wondering how to get one for them. The tragic innocence portrayed in this
anecdote is emotionally compelling and revealing of the times.
Question #1: For Ursula Mahlendorf:
In Ch. 3 of your memoir you say and I quote: “I still object when
contemporary German official publications, without referring to and explaining
that infamous history, claim as their own the intellectuals and artists
Germany disowned under Nazism.”
Why do you feel the publications continue to ignore the past? And will
this process of denial ever stop?
Question #2: For Josie Levy:
What made you decide to write in the third person? Was it easier this way
for you to reflect on your emotions and cope with your past?
